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Currently on hiatus :-(
 S&W in German/auf DeutschGaia (my fantasy comic) Scarlet (my science fantasy comic) |
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![[0633] Energy Crisis II](/comics/2014-11-13-0633-energy-crisis-ii.png "[0633] Energy Crisis II")
- Ye Thuza: To be fair, your fusion reactor is kinda impressive.
- Yuna: Thank you, mommy.
- Ye Thuza: What do you use as fuel?
- Yuna: A mixture of lithium, nickel, chili powder, …
- Yuna: … and shards of Cloud’s Princess Mononoke action figures.
- Ye Thuza: Now I finally understand why cold fusion has such a bad reputation.
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Sandra and Woo by Oliver Knörzer is licensed under the Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-NoDerivs 3.0 Unported License. See the About page for details.
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@ Lukkai:
Exactly. Spanking is a last resort, but an effective method nonetheless.
@ indorri:
It does not simply have immediate compliance. All creatures link up experiences with one another. Spanking made me think low grades were bad, and rewards from my parents made me feel that high grades were good, on a deeper level than just “good bad” grades. A lot of Regents kids in my school don’t give a damn.
And slapping a child’s hand does nothing. It doesn’t hurt, and if it does it’s even more of a bandage situation than spanking. It’s forgettable in an instant, and nothing is gained on either side.
Politics were never brought up here. Conservatives vs Liberals have no real place in a debate over spanking. I’m fine with gay marriage. Im pro life. I’m fine with a lot if things that make the country better. I’m not fine with unnecessary changes for the heck of it, or ones that are detrimental. I’m conservative, yes, but nothing I just said has relevance to spanking.
Lume wrote:
I do not see how my post leads into “…thus why my parents used it.”
Also, you are again using an poor non spanking example in your reasoning. First you mentioned taking away TV from a child who doesn’t care much about TV and now you mentioned taking away books. Stop assuming that parents who don’t spank their children are dumb (which you have to be to do any of those two examples), it makes no more sense than assuming parents who spanks their children have anger issues.
@ Crystalgate:
I am not assuming kids who don’t spank their parents are dumb. I admit I neglected to mention some things that would have cleared it up- we had few other pastimes, as we disliked sports and played few videogames. We had a small TV we didn’t care to watch. The only thing we really liked at the time was books- and they couldn’t exactly take that away from us. I apologize if that’s how it came out.
And my post led to “that’s why my parents used it” was because my parents were bright enough not to misuse it. I wasn’t spanked often. It was only when homework or grades would drop. And a parent who doesn’t spank their child is not dumb- TV may be an acceptable course of action. A parent who takes TV away from their kid and finds it doesn’t work has already laid the groundwork for the punishment- but they know not to do it again. If it worked, then they know they can do that. But it’s a soft punishment. It’s hardly suitable for a worse action. Yuna here literally shaved away a little over a thousand dollars. Each of those figurines are $335- and there are at least three that can be seen. There are probably more off screen. Those figures are damaged beyond repair. You can’t order her to replace it- she doesn’t have the money.
@ Lume:
I’m sorry, I’ll correct myself, there are TWO that can be seen- but that’s still $670 with the possibility of more on the table.
@ Lume:
That clarifies things. I think I’m understanding your posts now.
As for softness of punishment goes though, you can create various levels of harshness without spanking, I’d definitely pick something harsher than “No TV” for Yuna’s misdeeds.
I’m realizing that actually explaining why I don’t approve of corporal punishment would be a whole essay though, so I’m going to skip a full explanation. I will however note that I think spanking is effective and easy to use. This may sound like a good thing to you, but I’m uneasy about behavior changing actions that are both effective and easy to use.
@ Crystalgate:
Ok, I’m glad I cleared things up. I knew something seemed off…
As long as it’s a positive action one is trying to enforce I believe it is perfectly fine. Instilling a negative trait or spanking for minor offenses IS child abuse, but I believe that would fall under a different subject. The context here is clear and not too subject to opinion, I think. Spanking is effective and easy to use, yes, but many times it’s a punishment for a negative trait that would eventually harm them. Yuna has learned not to destroy other’s property.
Topics of controversy are interesting to debate on…
@ Burger:
Can you imagine how dangerous Luna would grow up to be if her parents had bought into that absurd “spanking is child abuse” fad-of-the-week?
Isn’t it illegal to spank a child?
@ xXEMERALD_W0LFXx:
Not in America. Not sure about other countries, but right now we’re debating whether spanking is child abuse and/or an acceptable course of action.
I was rather shocked by this comic, but, honestly, Ye Thuza straight up murdered that teacher to resolve that recent arc. So inappropriate violence from her is pretty much a given.
Honestly, I’ve never personally met someone who was spanked as a child who then grew up to be a sane, productive member of society. But, as an American, I have come to the distressing conclusion that nearly everyone everyone in my country over forty is a self-destructive idiot or an ignorant bigot. Your mileage may vary
@ Neospector:
Its awesome 😀 almost all of Hayao Miyazakis films are amazing.
@ edysunnybrook:
I’m still thinking the room was filled with phallic symbols as a final threat.
edysunnybrook wrote:
Funny I met about 100 percent of people in central europe who are quite productive members of society when spanking was a norm. And it was perfectly fine if teacher did it.
And usually when child complained parents put in even more.
Pain is basic survival mechanism – when something is painfull it appeals to you basic instinct for survival – you stop doing it. If not it will eventualy kill you. Proved by a billion years of evolution. Contrary to what I see in my society lack of violence is drasticaly worsening the situation for current generation.
I am willing to admit that it may work for your society, but I can definitely say that it does not work in mine. So appling your rules where I live will produce only a tragedy. It is producing it now.
Rayman wrote:
That’s because this is as much “child abuse” as putting convicted criminals in jail is “adult abuse.”
Jumtrev wrote:
Are you kidding? She’s lucky Ye Thuza got to her first! It looks like Yuna got through San and Moro…if Cloud got to Yuna first, she would be lucky if she ONLY died. We’re talking Lovecraftian level endgame here.
@ Silverwolf:
Like… One winged angels?
@ INTERVENTOR:
Well, actually the primary “Waste” product from successful Fusion is Helium Gas.
That’s why everyone who works in a Fusion Plant talks like Donald Duck…
@ edysunnybrook:
We don’t KNOW that she murdered the teacher.
The woman may just be stuck in a nice little Third World country where they will Truly Appreciate her “Enlightened” views on Women’s Liberation.
@ Jerry:
She might be stuck in 19th century England. And subsequently placed into an asylum.
Here’s one question that is seriously puzzling me…. Everyone who iscreaming “This little girl gett a spanking as child abuse”, where were your posts when Ye-Thuza threatened to decapitate Cloud? Considering it was right after teacher went “poof”, you can’t be entirely certain she was bluffing, yet no-one said a word?????
Really????
and of the two, you this this is more psychologically damaging??????
@ DLKmusic:
Getting spanked is certainly more psychologically damaging than getting decapitated, yes. (Physically, not so much)
Snorf wrote:
Yet the threat of decapitation certainly has a strong psychological affect (perhaps enough of an effect that Teen pregnancy won’t be a problem between Cloud and Sandra)… especially when you are holding a Katana…. My point was no-one raised a voice then. ???
Maybe taking something away from Yuna that she cherished might have been a better punishment, I don’t know, but Ye-Thuza has shown time and again how much she loves her children, this is certainly not abuse, and I find it troubling that people don’t see outside of thier own little boxes.
Please don’t get me wrong here… I’m not voicing an objection or taking offense to either strip, and I am a firm fanatic of Sandra and Woo. I love this strip, and have followed it faithfully since I discovered it. I just kinda wish people would stop complaining and enjoy the show once in a while.
@ DLKmusic:
Yes. Please. I myself have heard more wars going on here than I care for. It’s good for these kinds of debates to occur, but it feels like the ones here don’t go very far. I was glad that this was rather tame than the Cambridge arc, though.
@ D-Rock:
Amen, Brother, You Testify!
@ indorri:
Yeah, nice try but not an accurate comparison. Good parents will spank their children in order to make them realize their mistakes, never in excess or for no reason. Spanking your spouse, a mature fully grown responisible-for-their-own-actions adult, is abuse because they are old in enough to have a developed moral and ethical code of behavior, as opposed to a child who is Still Learning How To Act in Society.
An example I would think of is Gordon Ramsey’s behavior between Kitchen Nightmares and Junior Masterchef. He never yells or swears at the child chefs in Junior Masterchef because they are kids, sensitive and learning and trying their best. He yells and swears quite often in Kitchen Nightmares because he is sent in to fix restaurants run by incompetant, untalented adult cooks who sometimes even have the gall to outright refuse his advice and verbally abuse him instead. Why is this? Because their adults, and their supposed to know better.
Bottom line, small amounts of pain as punishment now and then can be used to discipline to help the child learn from their mistakes. Inflicting pain on an adult is a crime because both of the parties involves should be mature and intelligent enough to resolve a conflict without violence, it is not discipline.
indorri wrote:
Sorry this was the comment I was responding to above ^
@ Paeris Kiran:
I’m willing to accept that different cultures may lead to thought patterns and value different enough that my judgements may not be relevant. However, S&W is set in the United States, with an author who is from a country with a strong cultural influence on the U.S.
I find it suspicious, that, with all the manner huge cultural upheaval present in the world at large, and in Eastern Europe specifically, you can trace the curbing of corporal punishment as a large causal factor in perceived (or real for all I know) in degenerate of behaviors and standards in young people in your culture. I know, in my country, standards and behavior have improved radically from recent generations, but the older set often claim the opposite in defiance of all evidence. But, as I said, your mileage may vary.
@ Lume:
Where did you get the idea that I find men threatening? I just think that using violence to assert authority is dysfunctional and usually traumatizing. How does that mention gender at all? Don’t assume everyone with radically different views that you is a stupid stereotype.
Lume wrote:
They are, if the debate stays civil and respectful. Absolutely!
Also fun and informative.
As to the state of our youth, a topic that has been grazed a few times now: It is better than people often make it out to be. And I don’t think there has ever been a time where older people weren’t partially furious about and disappointed in the “rotten behaviour and wretched morals of the youth of today!”
Amy MacDonald wrote a nice song on that topic. One of my favourite of hers.
@ Camera Leon:
… your example is as to way inflicting pain on a child is not abuse, but inflicting pain on your spouse is is to use an example where someone deliberately acts in a gentler manner towards children but harsher towards adults? You should really reconsider your analogy.
It SHOULD be the exact opposite according to this logic: kids aren’t as experienced, so you have to teach them through gentler methods.
@ DLKmusic:
It probably has more to do with how closely it mirrors reality and to what extent it’s contentious and approved in society. Being threatened to be decapitated by a katana is outrageous and excessive, and therefore funny. If Cloud were threatened to being beaten to death with a plastic pipe, it’d be a little closer to home and probably very unfunny.
Ok even thought I am late to this comment page here’s my view on spanking
Number 1) I think it’s unfair, in my opinion it’s not right that a child should be subject to physical punishment where a criminal is not. The government is not allowed to use corporal punishment; work bosses are not allowed to use corporal punishment, so why should parents be allowed to use corporal punishment on children?
Number 2) also some people find spanking to be Sexually arousing and if i am honest the fact something thats used for sexual activity is also used for child discipline that really worrys me
greengear wrote:
Erm… No offense. But some people (many people actually) find getting compliments and cute nicknames arousing. You want people to stop doing that to children as well?
Or kissing? (Quite normal as a way of greeting, at least among friends and relatives, in many countries.)
Or ruffling hair?
I could go on if you want to.
@ RWB:
Second.
@ Lukkai:
ok first getting compliments, cute nicknames or ruffling hair are not used as corporal punishment they are in most cases acts of love, but if the person who’s get the compliments, cute nicknames, ruffling hair doesn’t want it when they not. I guess what I am saying is anything can be abused but I do see your point.
However i still believe that because we don’t use corporal punishment on adults we have no right to use it on children
Shouldn’t Cloud be getting spanked for having Princess Mononoke action figures?
Princess mononoke? You watch studio Ghibli?! YES
@ sasracer:
They are made of unobtainium, love, beauty, and sacrifice.
It’s the immeasurables that make it possible. She could probably fuse hydrogen into iron with that kind of catalyst.
I have to say, having just finished getting up to speed on this comic, that this is a very impressive debate. I never thought I would see a simple spanking panel in an online comic elicit so much discussion on the subject of spanking. Myself, I was never spanked as a child. With my daughter, she mostly got timeouts, but my wife and I always kept spanking as an option. Fortunately, she never earned more than a smack or two, and then only on fewer occasions than I can count on the fingers of one hand. In this case, I feel the punishment fit the crime. Just MHO.
Rare to see a spanking scene in anything today, I find it commendable as well as entertaining ^_^
If she was seriously evil she’d let Cloud into her room and then give him a sword and let him help himself. If she was one of those “OK now i’m mad” sort of people she’d lock Cloud and Yuna in the same room and wait until the ruckus stopped eesh I think the spanking is marginally better.
Being a mother of two strong-willed boys, spanking in moderate doses through their younger years established that I was the ultimate authority figure in their lives. Letting the State dictate that it is not allowed establishes that the State is the ultimate authority figure to them. Since the State doesn’t have to put up with the mess in their room and do their laundry, I object to that.
If done correctly, CP need only be done once or twice after children are old enough to understand verbal communication. Once they know you CAN and WILL spank them, (and possibly once more after some kid in their class tells them to threaten CPS on you*) then just the threat of spanking is enough to elicit obedience. So long as you preced and follow up with the reasons for the punishment and a hug or other show of love, the punishment is seen by the child to be an act of love.
The other important aspect is to never spank while angry. It sends to message that physical violence is allowed because of anger, which leads to all sorts of problems later in life.
To each their own. I only object to people trying to tell me what is best for my own children when they have NO CLUE what kind of person my kid is. My kids aren’t statistical models or archetypes, they’re undeveloped people with their own unique idiosyncrasies and needs and NO ONE knows what they need better than I do.
* My youngest son got his teacher to call CPS once… the case worker took my side then gave me her card to call if anyone else got too nosey about how I was raising my own children.
Yuna really had that ome coming, seriously i dont evem feel bad for her being spanked here.
@ xXEMERALD_W0LFXx:
that’s complete BS we are sane and good people because we were disciplimed as kids, every one gets punished for their bad deeds, kids as well, it need to rational or law would not exist.
@ Anime fan:
You probably can raise a good adult (that is the final goal) without being a sadist. Let us be blunt: Yes Thuza is spanking her kid because she destroyed something she cares about, not because she violated her brother’s right to his personal property. And the idea that children of sadists don’t go to jail or do not bleed working people dry is ridiculous to say the least.