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Is this a public list, or a “word of god”-type list?
If the former, then it really says something that Lilith, brand new to the scene, is already one of the top three and you can easily imagine her going even higher. If the latter, then something tells me that this so-called ‘supposed most powerful spell’ metric isn’t as accurate a measurement as it should be…
I wonder if Lilith is higher on the list than Alissa guessed because people are under the current assumption that she cast the Mass Teleport spell.
That is, if supposed power of the most powerful spell they are able to cast is not rigorously tested for.
Though that begs the question as to what San De Vertis and Aolistatse are know to have cast that they rank *even higher* than that…
Bree wrote:
According to Alissa before the Red Hall Attack, Lilith ranked at 8th. So I’m guessing the Mass Teleport spell she was rumoured to have cast is what bumps her up quite a few spaces on the list.
@ Alexander The 1st:
Wait. So, that Age-ending spell that is going to be cast in the future, and echoes back to the present, if they can pick apart the clues in the bluestream as the event gets nearer, and they determine who casts it, would that person immediately get top position?
Also a couple of questions, what do the bracketed things ([1] – [7], missing 8, [9] – [19], and two [-]) mean?
Additionally, will the names here not already in the glossary/cast pages be added in? (Or if they’re there already, will the detail about their supposed power be added into their entry?)
I’m guessing Eldor would be top 3 definitely if people knew what he could do.
Which is why I don’t think this list is “Word of God” (i..e it’s by reputation only) – Eldor should be in the top 20 list of wizards, at the very least…
@ Bree:
I guess those brackets are the positions last year/time Greendew Evening Standard did this list. And I am thinking this is very much a ‘we have some unfilled pages in tomorrows newspaper’ rather than anything official.
It is interesting to note that while Lilith was 14 on the previous list, San De Vertis has gone from outside it to being in first place.
It’s a list compiled by the Greendew Evening Standard.
The numbers in brackets are the previous positions.
Lilith cast a hole into the prison wall and broke an asymmetric spirit lock. That generated quite some buzz.
Alexander The 1st wrote:
Hmm, true. I also realized that Eldor Olenvis (who is quite clearly a rather powerful spellcaster, ESPECIALLY if he was directly involved in the attack) is not on the list, which means that it has to be a public one.
Speaking of the mass-teleport spell, though, if the rumor of it bumps Lilith up to third, then that would mean that someone powerful enough to cast it must be greater than 8 in the ranks. The only Midgard-aligned human wizard high enough on that list is Kairos Khan. It’d be interesting to check back and see if he’s the one they suspect cast the mass-teleport spell used in the attack.
@ Bree:
It looks like respective wizards’ positions from the previous installement of the list. That means San de Vertis and Arty Jannon are completely new to the scene while Lily previously ranked 14. Was San hiding? Did she choose a path of hermit to perfect her skills until she sensed the Spell’s wave from the future?
gilotyna815 wrote:
Arty was considered dead for most of the last decade.
Ranking a wizard by their most powerful known spell-casting can skew the list a bit. For instance, the high priestess could probably maintain that ranking if she didn’t (or can’t!) cast another spell for a year. I gather this is a method that prevents the major dragons from always hogging the top spots, as would be the case if the rankings were for sustained magic power.
… Am I alone in wanting to see a smackdown between Lilith and San de Vertis? I think it would be an amazing comic to see.
She might have jumped a few spots, but it’s still impressive that Lillith was -already- on that list even before she made her prison escape.
Novil wrote:
So presumably the Greendew Evening Standard decides to believe she can’t have performed the Mass Teleport spell now? Or are these considered more powerful spells?
If the former, then man – Lilith’s been jumping up and down this list like crazy.
If the latter…well, I certainly hope I never get on San’s or Aolilaste’s bad side…
Alexander The 1st wrote:
Yeah, I was wondering about that at first. But then I realized that Alissa was referring to a list published by the Aracona Times of just the top ten most powerful wizards in Cania (RH: 33); this list is the top 20 in all of Gaia and includes non-humans. Of course, that would have to mean that Lilith was bumped up a lot more than just from 8th place to 3rd place (apparently from 14th to 3rd).
I really like how she rocketed past Morian the Elder (#12) and Ariella of Cheysh (#8). When she cast an impenetrable shield spell that even Morian couldn’t counter (LJB: 43-47) and then that afternoon proceeded to unlock a reverse spirit lock that even Ariella could not open (LJB: 56-62), the Greendew Evening Standard couldn’t help but take notice. I imagine she also got a boost in the rankings after the expertise with shield spells that she demonstrated at the magic exams, surpassing even Hel and Ars (both of whom would probably be on this list if not for their unfortunate deaths in the attack) in terms of knowledge and cleverness (RH: 28-13).
Novil wrote:
So does that mean Arty Jannon has been outed as being still alive? How long has it been since the events of this chapter? Did someone at the Greendew Evening Standard already know he was still alive (along with Gradus [TS: 26]), and they were just waiting for Jael Bara to reveal herself before telling anyone?
Novil wrote:
Not to mention casting a “Lilith’s Black Marble” that defeated the best efforts of Morian the Elder, and two other mages.
Novil wrote:
…so this list comes from right after the breakout?
I must say, the Evening Standard takes a rather… tactful approach toward convicted terrorists, then.
(Also – “archmage”?)
I haven’t read the other comments, but has someone already mentioned that San de Vertis must be the friend
of Elea Calisto who was murdered by Elendor Olenvis ?
@Raen
What has the capability of a wizard to do with his alignment ? If you create a table of the wealthiest individuals
here in the world, you will find…erm…morally ambigous characters, too.
The list itself does not seem to list infamous characters except Lilith, but that can be simply explained:
Redmages, e.g. Eldor Olenvis, must remain in hiding because presumably they will hunted down
mercilessly when their identity is known.
TSK wrote:
Yes, that’s pretty much the conclusion everyone has come to. At least, we have no reason to suspect that Eldor was talking about another San in TS: 20.
As to San’s sister, some have speculated that Eldor meant Lilith, although I am very skeptical of that. I could see San de Vertis of Golnar and Lilith Caillean of Oakdale being “sisters” in a spiritual sense, but a biological relation would take a lot of explaining, especially since we got no indication that Lilith has any siblings other than her brother Dyson (TS: 2).
But yes, this San de Vertis is almost certainly the best friend of the late Elea Calisto. She apparently has just not had much time to grieve yet. Hopefully we see San going after the cult in Osterath to hunt down her murderers in the next chapter. And since Osterath (according to the Glossary) is the capital city of Golnar, and Golnar is south of Midgard, and Santhilia is also south of Midgard, and Ryn wants to take everyone to hide out in Santhilia (LJB: 74-75), then I think we can expect Lilith and the gang to bump into San sometime in the next chapter. Then our band of heroes will (presumably) be complete!
@ Bree:
The bracketed numbers, [1], look like they are the rank the person had on the last official listing.
In this case lilith was ranked 14 on the last list. The “[-]” would be those who were not ranked previously.@ Bree:
@ Scrutinizer:
I wager that San is Jael’s long-lost and/or hidden sister. Possibly taken into hiding due to someone knowing in advance about the attack on her parents. They just couldn’t save Jael in time…
Novil wrote:
Well, dang. I have only now realized what “asymmetric spirit lock” seems to imply. And in my line of work… I should be ashamed. (And, now that it’s no longer abstract to me, I have a newfound respect for Lillith’s abilities.)
This clearly means that at some point down the line Lilith and San de Vertis will have to fight it out for the top spot, although the fact that Eldor’s name isn’t on the list makes the rankings source suspect and inconclusive, or at least incomprehensive.
Morgan Walter Champion wrote:
Something tells me that Eldor is simply in league of his own,compared to the rest…
I find it interesting that Eldor apparently keeps not only his red-mage-ness a secret, but his blue-mage-ness too, which seems to be quite powerful based on what he did to Delvor.
Ken wrote:
I don’t think what he did to Delvor had anything to do with Blue magic.
Alexander The 1st wrote:
I’m sure that if people thought that she had actually cast the mass transport spell for the Red Hall massacre, she’d be number one. No one else had ever done it before except when Isaac and Llyra rescued the occupants of Mithra.
Also, I don’t think we can consider Alissa’s off-hand compliment about being number 8 as anything [i]remotely[/i] official.
Ken wrote:
He doesn’t have to keep it secret.
He simply has to keep the POWER of it secret.
That being said, while he’s certainly powerful enough that he *should* be on the list, something tells me he is NOT as strong as the “touched” themselves can be. He’s assuredly stronger than the “touched” are right now, but he wants the “touched” (which San is among and we’ve all basically assumed Lilith is, too) to be stronger. If he was stronger than the touched could end up being, then he wouldn’t need the touched for whatever he is planning. He only requires the help of the touched (and for them to be stronger than they currently are) if he, ultimately, isn’t as strong as they can be.
(Which is one reason that I’m actually under the impression Eldor Olenvis is likely an Antihero and/or Antivillain: Someone who is doing villainous things, but who has a noble goal. It wouldn’t surprise me if his aim is to SAVE the world. A rough allegation I can make is to Logan, from Fable III. If you’re familiar with that game, he serves as the antagonist for the first half of it, because as far as the hero knows, he’s gone off the deep end into villainy. But the truth on the second half of the game reveals that everything he did was in an attempt to save everything, but in order to save everything, he needed to make sacrifices.)
ITs where they were on the list before this list is made. Thats why nr 8 is missing.. he/she on that place is either dead or not strong enough to be on this list anymore 😉 @ Bree:
http://fable.wikia.com/wiki/Logan <–Link to Logan from Fable 3, btw. Like I said, it may be entirely coincidental, but a LOT of Eldor Olenvis's lines of dialog remind me of the kinds of things Logan himself said, and we KNOW that there's a bit of a parallel in setting, even if unintentional. (Threat of a force consuming the land.)
Hmm, I wonder if Daana’s de facto leader will get overthrown by Sigurd.
Related to Lilith’s ranking… I assume she originally got 8th from using teleotactile spells of the fourth level to mess with people’s hair (I kid, I kid). But seriousply the raised ranking might not have been *only* the suspected Mass Teleport. After all, it wasn’t shown that she had specifically cast it, let alone on her own (just “proven” that she had worked with the attackers). It might have also gone up due to her spells involving opening a whole in magic-resistant prison cells with anti-magic detectors/lazers and/or the Black Marble barrier she used during her escape. Black Marble I think was the most impressive one, probably, but it’s hard to judge without knowing more of the details of the magic system and how spells are ranked.
I originally considered that the spell she used to open the lock-box might have been considered, but it’s unlikely to be well known, even considering the “magic waves” phenomenon that San de Vertis was speaking about (considering a much larger future spell) would apply to it (and formed the basis of how she unlocked the box in the first place). It’s an interesting list all told.
One thing to bear in mind with the Greendew Evening Standard’s rankings – they’re headquartered in the capital city of Ileasaar, so are likely to remain fiercely independent of the Canian regime (as well as the regimes responsible for other Gaian countries). Oh, and while Lilith was accused of being a Midgard spy, she wasn’t accused of initiating the mass long distance teleport spell.
One aspect that puzzles me is the text colouring – most are black, others are blue or red. A simplistic interpretation would be bluestream / redstream, although in that case you’d expect far more to be coloured. As it’s a print publication, it’s unlikely to have the signifcance thost colours have in webified text (blue – we’ve written an extended profile on this person [hyperlink], red – we’re writing a profile but haven’t completed it yet [broken link]).
@mittfh: the colours indicate whether someone is human (black), dragon (blue) or imp (red), as far as I noticed.
Also, I wonder who would be number 8, too (drop from that position would likely mean that person is dead). Assuming that previous ranking (when Lilith was 14th) was from before the Red Hall Attack, that could have been Hel.
Can’t wait for the next chapter, though I guess fillers like this can be very, very interesting, too. :3
I have a feeling that Lilith is going to have to surpass the two wizards above her in some way either by being the one to cast the age-ending spell, having to defeat one of the two, or by defeating the ones (if any) who defeat both of the two…but this is just a feeling. I don’t really have anything to back this up other than the fact that I feel I’m sensing a pattern…
Huh, I thought Lilith would be the most powerful. based on what I’ve seen. though I’m not surprised a Dragon and then the Prophetess are higher, though it does scare me slightly to think of what they could then do. clearly I need to pay more attention to the plot.
that said, this is an interesting list, I’m presuming a ‘powerful’ spell would not rely purely on a persons ability but also there cunning and understanding. making a more efficient spell.
The numbering system suggests that Hel wasn’t even on the list? That seems surprising, considering his veneration and position.
It’s also somewhat curious that Eldor didn’t make the list either, but I suppose he’s happier not having people know exactly what he’s capable of.
Just being able to combine the blue and the red stream would probably in itself make it to the list.
San have traveled through(?) the void, (as the blue ghost), is that the feture that took her to first Place, in that case Eldor is at least in for a second Place being able to open the void. But Sans 1:place spell could have been something grander, at the other hand Eldor didn’t seem to consider opening hte void as something difficult, rather like opening a regular door…
And if it’s established that Lilith didn’t cast the mass teleportation spell, if they thought she had would that have rendered her first Place, and if so, there is someone out there who could claim the first Place. Eldor? Someone yet not revealed?
I like to think that the most powerful creatures are wise enought to hide their true nature…
@Lucid: again, the list doesn’t take into account dead people (that’s also why Arty Jannon suddenly appeared in the ranking), so I guess Hel could have been former number 8 (since that’s the number missing, and I doubt other wizards would suddenly cast something so powerful to dethrone that number) or he has been already dead at the time of making the previous ranking.
Yeah, why is San at the top of the list? I thought as a priest she didn’t do much magic. Is it a case that they assume she will be the one to cast this super-spell she’s heralding?
I noticed human females dominate the top 10.
At first I wondered how San had the courage (or the nerve from the dragons perspective) to come Before them to “preach” (in a sense), lecture (in another), maybe just warn, but, a mentioned, the dragons may perceive it differently. Sure they are friendly and all, but still. They are dragons. I wouldn’t have the guts to call myself the savoir of the World in front of a dragon, less so infront of a whole bunch.
Then again, I’m not San, the most prominent magic wielder in the world. Does the dragons know that fact, and how would it contribute to their reactions towards this “prophet”?
Arty is hinted at being known to be alive by this, and the fact the priestess could get the dragons to listen to her must put her at number one.
But why did number 8 get knocked off is the question here. Perhaps #8 was eldor?
M. Peach wrote:
If you only look at the humans, sure. It’s 50/50 though gender-wise, for the top 10; and overall males populate the total list.
I wonder why there is no Faye Galitas on the list. Interesting: on which positions are Academy’s personal, if below #20.
@ LeoArrenius:
It seems to me that Faye was placed high in the ranks of the Academy, but not as a mage – much rather a martial arts / sword fighting teacher. This Academy isn’t focused on mages alone, it looks like they prefer to train duos – fighter + mage (Ilias + Ryn, Alissa + Lilith). Of course, mages learn about fighting as well, and so do warriors learn about magic.
Regarding the missing former number 8, my gut feeling is that the former 8th ranked spellcaster is the woman Eldor killed at the beginning of Castle in the Sky.
Sunflower wrote:
No. What I mean is, if you look at their “former” rankings, and considered that Hel(being dead) is off the list, you’d be able to figure out about where he placed based upon how much everyone’s rank had changed.
The changes presented versus the list as it is now makes no room for Hel to have been on the list, unless he was formerly #20. If he was, it seems strange that he was at the academy that Lilith went to, when there’s another, more powerful headmaster(who, thus, would be more-able to teach her).
So either he never made the list to begin with(so it makes no sense that Lilith stayed at his academy) or he was forgotten when this was made.